Discussion Factory Shipwrite

[Niko]

I have spoken with server hosts regarding the topic of ship part factory runs.

This is a major leap and I want to hash this out from every angle. Making this change will be a significant break away from what live servers established. I do not like making sweeping changes and I want to make certain this is properly vetted before proceeding.

To clarify, what I am proposing is the possibility of making all or most crafted ship parts and components factory compatible.

By necessity this would exclude collection schematics. These would still be single craft only.

While I am interested in discussing the pros of this (and I’m sure we can come up with plenty), what I really want to flesh out are the cons. How can this be exploited or used inappropriately? How could this negatively affect the economy or the profession? For what reason did the original devs make these items single craft only?

Im told the change is relatively easy so I’m putting a timeline of 2-4 weeks for this. I want to make absolutely certain there isn’t something I’m missing or not considering before we pull this genie out of the bottle.

/discuss vigorously

 

[ShatteredSaga]

I don't forsee a huge problem, most of the overpowered parts are Reverse engineered anyway if I recall correctly. And correct me if I am wrong, but player crafted parts cannot be reverse engineered. And honestly a glut of ship parts to buy while grinding up looted parts would be a good thing imho. The only problem I could think of is mass produced missiles and countermeasures.

 

[Randolo]

I won't lie, I can't think of any downsides, Not many (if any) of the stock craftable parts are better than optimized RE'd stuff, of course there are exceptions probably but to the best of my knowledge it's few and far between.

I think there's far more benefits to it, than downsides.

If mass produced missiles and countermeasures are a concern, maybe make *those* only small batch factory crates or something to try and deter that

 

[Niko]

Exemptions

- collection schematics
- Nova/Orion weapon schematics
- Nova/Orion engine schematics
- borstel schematics?
- chassis?

 

[Niko]

I don't forsee a huge problem, most of the overpowered parts are Reverse engineered anyway if I recall correctly. And correct me if I am wrong, but player crafted parts cannot be reverse engineered. And honestly a glut of ship parts to buy while grinding up looted parts would be a good thing imho. The only problem I could think of is mass produced missiles and countermeasures.

Which can both already be factory run so no change there

 

[Randolo]

Exemptions

- collection schematics
- Nova/Orion weapon schematics
- Nova/Orion engine schematics
- borstel schematics?
- chassis?

I think Chassis would be ok to exempt? It's not like anyones out there buying 4 B-Wings. Definitely any one time use schematics. Not sure about the crafted Borstel Schematics and how they compare though

 

[ShatteredSaga]

Which can both already be factory run so no change there

Then that's one problem that doesn't need dealt with. I think anything based off of schematics should be non factory capable, but any other craftable parts should be clear.

 

[Goso]

I personally feel anything that is in the profession wheel should be able to be made in a factory. All professions except shipwright can already do this.
Currently the only things that can be ran in factory by shipwright is missiles, countermeasures, paint kits, texture kits, , all ship part sub components, and all of the repair tools for shop components.
I personally see no downside to this at all. The benefit of having mass produced ship parts for grinding purposes is much better than the monotony of one time craft of each final part.

 

[Goso]

Exemptions should definitely be the specialty schematics like collection, nova-Orion, the schematics that occasionally drop from convoys. The schematics you can purchase with GCW 2 tokens as well

 

[Headshot]

anything that eases the barrier to entry (well stocked vendors due to ease of running factory schems) is good imo. Aside from intentional one-time use schems as mentioned above.

 

[Niko]

I personally feel anything that is in the profession wheel should be able to be made in a factory. All professions except shipwright can already do this.
Currently the only things that can be ran in factory by shipwright is missiles, countermeasures, paint kits, texture kits, , all ship part sub components, and all of the repair tools for shop components.
I personally see no downside to this at all. The benefit of having mass produced ship parts for grinding purposes is much better than the monotony of one time craft of each final part.

I’m with you… I’m trying like hell to find a downside. Something that the previous devs saw that I didn’t. A hole somewhere…. I just can’t find one. I’m hoping that with as many heads in this as possible we can go in with confidence but I’m really struggling to come up with a way this will cause problems.

only thing I can think of…. If someone does a run and a new resource spawn pops up or someone ceases one better it can make someone’s stock drop in value but in all reality that’s true for all crafting professions.

I just done want to give muhtar the go ahead and realize too late that it was a huge mistake so I want to try to think of everything

 

[ShatteredSaga]

I’m with you… I’m trying like hell to find a downside. Something that the previous devs saw that I didn’t. A hole somewhere…. I just can’t find one. I’m hoping that with as many heads in this as possible we can go in with confidence but I’m really struggling to come up with a way this will cause problems.

only thing I can think of…. If someone does a run and a new resource spawn pops up or someone ceases one better it can make someone’s stock drop in value but in all reality that’s true for all crafting professions.

I just done want to give muhtar the go ahead and realize too late that it was a huge mistake so I want to try to think of everything

What I wonder, Niko, is whether or not ship parts being factory compliant was simply a dev oversight rather than a deliberate design decision.

 

[Niko]

What I wonder, Niko, is whether or not ship parts being factory compliant was simply a dev oversight rather than a deliberate design decision.

I don’t think so. I think it goes back to pre-cu. The game was designed to be symbiotic. SW is the only profession where the sub components are mostly made by the SW. I think it was a safeguard to protect the profession.

think if this….

I have been on this server for 3+ years. I have boarded gobs of resources and have a better understanding of how to craft these parts better than most. If I do a factory run of really great engines, where is the incentive for anyone else to ever bother making one.

the counter argument is that is also true for all other professions as well

 

[ulilis]

Exemptions

- collection schematics
- Nova/Orion weapon schematics
- Nova/Orion engine schematics
- borstel schematics?
- chassis?

I always play a lot in space and I am just starting on this server. For me I 100% agree with this with the exemptions listed above the only one I am on the fence with is the chassis but the current markets are about dry with starting parts so its been rough just getting going over here but its been doable. but if we allow factory crates it would help the crafters out a lot and help fill the current market gaps in the leveling process etc. As for the chassis I can see it both ways as a factory run would be nice but maybe limit it to a smaller number per batch.

 

[ShatteredSaga]

I don’t think so. I think it goes back to pre-cu. The game was designed to be symbiotic. SW is the only profession where the sub components are mostly made by the SW. I think it was a safeguard to protect the profession.

think if this….

I have been on this server for 3+ years. I have boarded gobs of resources and have a better understanding of how to craft these parts better than most. If I do a factory run of really great engines, where is the incentive for anyone else to ever bother making one.

the counter argument is that is also true for all other professions as well

And I think that's very true, and was something countered with item decay, thus requiring the repurchase of items from time to time. When item decay was in place, crafters got far more business due to a higher demand. Now, with no decay, you can purchase an item once and never need another. So crafters got nerfed hard in terms of sales due to that. I remember on live there were several crafters who made good money selling crates of cheap weapons knowing that they'd wear out and need to be replaced. Iirc when JtL first came out, components decayed on ship destruction. I will be honest I may not be remembering correctly, it was 20 years ago.

 

[Wynton]

The only downside that I see is a large amount of items hitting the market at once and dropping prices. To be honest with this population size it’s not the same as if we had 2k-3k people logging on every day.
I would say that this is a positive change

 

[Sage-]

I have spoken with server hosts regarding the topic of ship part factory runs.

This is a major leap and I want to hash this out from every angle. Making this change will be a significant break away from what live servers established. I do not like making sweeping changes and I want to make certain this is properly vetted before proceeding.

To clarify, what I am proposing is the possibility of making all or most crafted ship parts and components factory compatible.

By necessity this would exclude collection schematics. These would still be single craft only.

While I am interested in discussing the pros of this (and I’m sure we can come up with plenty), what I really want to flesh out are the cons. How can this be exploited or used inappropriately? How could this negatively affect the economy or the profession? For what reason did the original devs make these items single craft only?

Im told the change is relatively easy so I’m putting a timeline of 2-4 weeks for this. I want to make absolutely certain there isn’t something I’m missing or not considering before we pull this genie out of the bottle.

/discuss vigorously

I think if it will help get items to players so they can Ace pilot, or gear up a ship in a timely manner. Would be great for the server, and the economy as a whole

 

[sam2h]

The only downside that I see is a large amount of items hitting the market at once and dropping prices. To be honest with this population size it’s not the same as if we had 2k-3k people logging on every day.
I would say that this is a positive change

This.

It does a lot to help a smaller population, and one such population that has next to nothing for crafted space parts.

 

[Jariah]

The only downside I can think of with this would be data tables and I don't even know if it is an issue. It's the only thing I can think of that stopped them on live other than using up resources and ppl deleting bad roll crafts.
Plenty of positives though as it will bring the profession up to spec with the rest. It doesn't take the live aspect away as anyone can still make individual items, just expands it to allow running large batches of items.
One thing I will comment on though is crate sizes should be a minimum of 100. Why this isn't standardized I have no idea. With the bug of losing the last crates item 1 in 100 is bearable. Losing 1 in 5 like a DE does with crated Droids is just a waste of everything that goes into them. That bug is the same as the last item losing it's socket.
Of course as has already been mentioned it should only include profession wheel items. I have no issue if someone were to do chassis as well.

 

[Ecosse]

The only thing I can think of that would have stopped them doing the factory crates in live is crit rolls.
I am not as familiar with SW as other professions but in BM and WS crit roll subs can make a difference but not massivily overall.
would any sw components that are crit rolled with crit subs be massilvely overpowered?
You would need a whole bunch of resource to do it but is the potential there?